Pump rebuild

[Wildcatworth]

When do you know if your pump needs rebuilding?  It seems that I am getting less pressure than I have in the past.  Also, is rebuilding a pump a big job?  I have a 3 x 3 pump from easy lawn (don't know the pump brand).  Turboguy, you usually know what pumps everyone uses, is this one you would have a rebuild kit for, or do I need to get it from the pump manufacturer.  Any info on rebuilding a pump would be appreciated.

[HTI]

Easy Lawn has their own line of pumps but having said that most centrifugal pumps have few wear type parts, a seal normaly made of a ceramic type material that if worn out would be leaking between the pump and motor and possibly a steel wear plate that could be the cause of pressure loss, replacement really depends on location and how difficult seperating the two halves would be due to that location, there are other possibilities such as a partially plugged hose, valve, or fitting, especially in a tight 90 degree turn.

[firedude26]

Well i agree with Hti on possiblities of clog somewhere, but i rebuilt my banjo 3x3 last fall and it was easy, it cost me about 200 bucks, took longer to dissamble it from motor than to replace all the internal parts. the is a wear plate a impeller and seals, also a few new bolts, just make sure you have the proper spacing from the plate and the impellor. Not sure what easy lawn uses but you should be able to contact them for parts.

Good Luck

[muddstopper]

Hey firedude,
Since you have a banjo pump heres a tip for you. When the pressure starts to drop you can reset the spacing between the impeller and the wear place to bring it back up to par. Another thing I did was to make a shim to place behind the wear plate, What I found was that as I reset the space between the impeller and wear plate, the back of the impeller was getting further away from the pump housing and letting material get behind it and locking the machine down. Placeing the shim behind the wear plate allowed me to put the impeller back to the housing and still have the proper clearance between the impeller and plate. I dont know if you can do the same for the easylawn pump or not but a shim is a lot cheaper that the other parts. I made my shim out of sheet metal.

[firedude26]

I beleive that you can still adjust the impeller by loosing up the coller to he motor, put you feeler gauge in and retighten. I never really thought of readjusting the pump after som much use, THANKS MUDD !!!!!!!!!!!!

Well like they sa " you learn something new everyday"


Help i am in desperate need of spelchek, lol

[muddstopper]

I found that using a feeler guage to set the impeller was next to impossible. The finns on the impeller are also cut on a taper so proper placement of the feeler guage is also nessicary. What I found that works pretty good was to take an old hacksaw blade and grind the teeth off of it and place it between the impeller and wear plate. The blade is long enough to reach from top to bottom of the impeller and is still long enough to get a hold of to pull out after the clearance is set. I usually place the guage between the plate and impeller before I loosen the clamp on the shaft, that way the spring on the seal will push the impeller against the guage as I loosen the clamp. I have done mine so often that I can just about do it in the dark.

[firedude26]

that is funny, after i placed that reply i forgot to mention that i used the same thing for feeler gauges, hacksaw blade with teeth ground off for the large opening and i used the blade with the side ground out to make it fit on both sides of the impellor to make sure that we had equal spacing. I thouhgt it was crazy at first but now i see i am not the only one, lol.

[Turboguy]

Hi Worth,

Someplace I have a note with the name of the pumps Easy Lawn uses, but I don't know if I could find it if I tried.   They are made in Ohio,  possibly goulds.    We are pretty open about whose pump we use.  Easy Lawn likes to keep that confidential which is fine.  There is nothing wrong with that.  You are probably going to have to get your repair parts from Easy Lawn.

There have been some very good comments about pumps and pump sericing here and I think I agree with all the things that have been said so far.  

Usually wear in a pump is that the material between the impeller and the volute have worn creating an opening that robs the power.   Shims can often be a cheap fix.  Otherwise the impeller and volute need to be replaced.   With some pumps that can be done without removing the housing from the engine.  Other times not.    You will probably have to replace the seal to boot.   You can try without.  

There are other causes of power loss.   A build up of fertilizer or material in the suction line can create a problem.  Even a tiny leak in the suction line can create a problem.   This is far more important than many people realize.   A bad gasket in the suction line can do it.  

If you have not run lime in your unit I would not rule out the problem being in the suction area.   There is also a possiblity of damage in the impeller.  Sometimes a vane can get knocked off the impeller by a rock or the like.

[Wildcatworth]

Let me explain what it is doing, maybe you guys can tell from my description.  With about 1/4 tank left, the pressure drops enough that I shut off the agitation, and just have it going thru the hose.  Once I shut off agitation, of course I have plenty of pressure.  If I pump the tank dry, it takes several seconds to prime the pump once I fill back up with water.  I have no leakes.  Another thing it does is that the pressure will rise and fall periodically while spraying or agitating.  I am not very familiar with the internal workings of the pump.  I have not had it apart,  so it would all be trial and error for me.  Again, any help is appreciated.  Thanx Worth

[muddstopper]

Wildcat,
 it sounds to me like you are having suction problems. The pump should prime itself as soon as the water level reaches high enough to get to the pump. The surging sounds like it is cavitating which means it is sucking air or making its own air. I would take the suction line off and check it to make sure there wasnt anything blocking it, look in it dont just run something down it. Any restriction on the suction could cause this. I have also seen suction line collaspe on the inside, this is especialy true if you have the rubber suction hoses, seen this a lot with hydraulics, they have a tendence to come apart on the inside after a lot of use and old age.  If the suction line is clean you might have some broke finns on the impeller or the impeller to wear plate clearance is to wide. Most of the centrifical pumps should have a way of adjusting the clearances. As for taking these pumps apart, The impeller is the only moving part and it will only fit one way. The seal is the hardest part to replace and it just pushes in by hand no special tools needed. The hardest part is prying the two halves apart.

[Wildcatworth]

Muddstopper, thanx, it sounds like it might be a suction problem, that makes sense.  That would probably be the easiest fix, but the info on the pump is helpful also.  I have had the unit 3 years, and hydroseed part time (about 100 tanks mixed and sprayed per year), and have only used granular 19-19-19 this season.  Should I be having pump problems, or is that something that could go any time?

[Turboguy]

Hi Worth,
I think Muddstopper gave you some great info.   My guess is that after 300 tanks +/-  I would not normally expect to see any appreciable pump wear with what you are using.  I am not saying it is impossible but I think I would look at the suction line first and look for pump damage second.

[turborob]

Hello Wildcat,

The pump could be a Barnes pump as I have had other customers searching for the origin of this pump.  They are located somewhere in the mid-west.  I should have a phone number for you in a few days.  You might want to also check your suction flange gasket or flapper gasket located usually in (behind) the bottom inlet (suction) port inside a square box.  It could also cause priming problems in the pump if it was torn or totally gone (passed through the impeller.)  But also mudstopper's advice would be the first thing to check, a clogged or leaking suction line would hamper the pump from self-priming.

[turborob]

Hello Wild Cat,

Call this number and ask for Phil.  It is most likely a Barnes pump, manufactured in Canada.  I guess if you email this guy pics or give him casting numbers he can get parts for you at a good price.

Pump Systems, Inc.
PO Drawer 1940
530 25th Ave. E
Dickinson, ND 58601
(800) 437-8076 - (701) 225-4494
Fax (701) 225-0320

[muddstopper]

The suction gasket, if it was letting the pump suck air could cause the problem but just because the flapper is gone doesnt mean it will not pump. The flapper is only there to keep water from draining back out of the pump and into the tank. Whenever you are pumping it is completely open anyways. I actually took the flapper out of my pump so I could pump water back thru the suction line in the event of a clogg. Unless your pump is higher than the tank, water will run into the pump whenever you are filling the tank and prime the pump so I see no reason to have the flapper valve installed. It also lets me place mulch in my tank before water because I can pump the water into the tank by hooking up my little pump to my machine pump and pump water backwards thru the machine pump and suction hose and into the tank that way. Water flowing backward thru the suction hose will push any mulch or fertilizer, that may have gotten into the hose and cause a clogg, into the tank. It also lets me use my spray hose to fill my tank if my water source is to far away to use the rollup firehose that came with my little pump. Of course filling you tank this way when hooked to a city fire hydrant is frowned upon because of not haveing some sort of back flow preventer in the line. But I have yet to hook to a hydrant so I dont have to worry about it but, I usually only do this to clear a clogged suction and normally fill from the top of the tank.